Gender Identity Poll

[NautilusWolf]

So, now I am not trying to offend anyone here, but I just have some questions for the non-cis identifying furs on this thread! These questions are based to gain knowledge and not to offend.

So, we talk about gender roles in our society, the Male and the Female, and we talk about how it is society that contributes to these gender stereotypes, men being muscle bound and tough and women being weak and "girly". Now my question is what exactly does a transgender, bi-gender or genderfluid person identify as in terms of what they see the opposite gender being? How would a transgender person define gender? How does a male transgender person, for example, identify what "girl" means to her, does she focus on the body of the girl, the sexual organs and so forth? Does she focus on the cultural inclination of the girl?

Because to me it creates a confusing contradiction, that if gender roles are psychological and society based, then transgenderism (in the psychological aspect) must also then be psychological and society based (If this were true transgenderism would be as changeable as social gender roles), otherwise if transgenderism is biologically based, then gender roles must also be biological based. I've concluded that both gender roles and transgenderism must be BOTH biologically AND psychological, but I want to know a non-cisgenders opinion on the matter.

For me, my best explanation as a gender-fluid fur would be that it's a self image concept. Dumbing it down because I like being blunt about it, it's how we feel. Some days I feel more masculine and identify as a male, other days I feel more feminine and identify as female. Kind of like how you view yourself in a mirror. Now, physically, I don't see a change, but my "mind's eye" sees a female when I identify as such. It seems complex with all of the official wording and vocabulary, but it's quite simple, really.

[anoni]

Yeah, the problem is that "feeling" is a very subjective term, and so I'm trying to decipher why you "feel" one gender or another and what originates from that feeling. Not why are you gender-fluid, but more when you say you "feel" like a girl or a boy, what does 'girl' and 'boy' mean to you and how do you define that 'today I feel like a girl' or so forth, is it based on social standards? Or is it unknown.

[Nrein]

Obviously I'm not non-cis, but I have/had quite a few friends that are/have been, and from the way they described it, it seemed really based on the societies understanding of what it meant to be a "girl" or a"boy." Be it from personality, how you dressed, etc.

[NautilusWolf]

Yeah, the problem is that "feeling" is a very subjective term, and so I'm trying to decipher why you "feel" one gender or another and what originates from that feeling. Not why are you gender-fluid, but more when you say you "feel" like a girl or a boy, what does 'girl' and 'boy' mean to you and how do you define that 'today I feel like a girl' or so forth, is it based on social standards? Or is it unknown.

Well, determining which gender I identify as, it's best described as a "gut feeling." Hard to explain if you aren't the one feeling it, but I guess it's based off of what you feel closest to. It's not quite based on societal standards or ideology, more of the psychological aspect of self image. It may be because I have a very nurturing personality. There's no easy way to explain it!   And when I feel female, I feel more open to share myself. I'm more trusting, and loving. Although, I'm like that male too.   Really, being Female TO ME, is how I view myself. With the norms we are taught, women are given more emotional room. Now, I'm an emotional person, in the sense that I show a lot of it, and since that is the established norm, it does seem fitting. Now, I know what you're thinking, "then why not be an emotionally open male?" Sadly, I don't have an exact answer. It's self image, and you'd need an understanding to psychology, FAR greater than my own, since I barely know anything.   I identify as Female because it's who I view myself as. It's who I am on the inside. Hard to understand unless you belong to this group... I hope I helped even a little bit!

[HyenaKing]

Very much reading.
I'm bigender.

[George]

I think "gender identity" doesn't need to be a thing. To me, gender is just a classification of what bits n' pieces you got. Whether you feel more girly or manly is just based on the individual, so why try to conform to a title?

[Midnight Madness]

The thing is, as long as those bits and pieces are around, people will just identify people as their determinate sex, which a decent number of people will not be entirely comfortable with. So the debate will just rise again. Gender in itself may be a construct of humanity, but we are all equally sentient beings in our own right, all exposed to the same information, and so it will be something prevalent in society.

[George]

The thing is, as long as those bits and pieces are around, people will just identify people as their determinate sex

Is this not ok? No offence intended, but why is it relevant what gender you feel like? Gender seems like a biological thing, not a psychological thing. If I was super girly but still had male parts, I'd just call myself male anyway.

[Midnight Madness]

I just realized how terribly worded that sentence is, I think I got unfocused while typing there. It's not bad for people to identify others by their determinate sex, because how can anyone know their preferences until they get to know them?

Forget my last comment, what I meant to say was this:

So long as those bits and pieces are around, there will be people who feel like they are not the right ones for them. Gender is a human construct, but sex is something defined by nature. So, in short, gender = psychological, sex = biological. Nobody can refute the fact that their body is that of a male or female, but you can believe that you were wrongly given said body.

[George]

I just meant folx should lighten up. You get what you get, so try to enjoy it instead of trying to bring the faults to light!

[Jack Lionheart]

I just meant folx should lighten up. You get what you get, so try to enjoy it instead of trying to bring the faults to light!

Much easier said than done. Gender dysphoria (feeling that your gender identity doesn't line up with your physical sex) is a very serious problem. It causes low self-worth, depression, and social anxiety. It's a lot better when people are allowed to express the gender identities, regardless of physical sex.


I'm not sure you could possibly understand the depth with which some people feel gender dysphoria. It's not as simple or superficial as someone saying "I don't like the shape of my nose," or "I don't like my freckles." Those are things that you pretty much just have to get used to, and a lot of people can get used to those things. When your gender identity doesn't match up to your physical sex everything feels wrong, from the way people treat you to the clothes you can wear based on society's perception of you.

[George]

I just meant folx should lighten up. You get what you get, so try to enjoy it instead of trying to bring the faults to light!

I'm not sure you could possibly understand the depth with which some people feel gender dysphoria. It's not as simple or superficial as someone saying "I don't like the shape of my nose," or "I don't like my freckles." Those are things that you pretty much just have to get used to, and a lot of people can get used to those things. When your gender identity doesn't match up to your physical sex everything feels wrong, from the way people treat you to the clothes you can wear based on society's perception of you.

What makes you think I don't know this? If you're in the wrong body, then that's different I'm saying people like this are the ones who don't need to worry:

Yeah, the problem is that "feeling" is a very subjective term, and so I'm trying to decipher why you "feel" one gender or another and what originates from that feeling. Not why are you gender-fluid, but more when you say you "feel" like a girl or a boy, what does 'girl' and 'boy' mean to you and how do you define that 'today I feel like a girl' or so forth, is it based on social standards? Or is it unknown.

Well, determining which gender I identify as, it's best described as a "gut feeling." Hard to explain if you aren't the one feeling it, but I guess it's based off of what you feel closest to. It's not quite based on societal standards or ideology, more of the psychological aspect of self image. It may be because I have a very nurturing personality. There's no easy way to explain it!   And when I feel female, I feel more open to share myself. I'm more trusting, and loving. Although, I'm like that male too.   Really, being Female TO ME, is how I view myself. With the norms we are taught, women are given more emotional room.

That's just personality, on my opinion. Sure (s)he feels more feminine or masculine at times, but I think gender only becomes an issues when it's an actual dysphoria and you need medical help. I've known this guy who was born a girl since we were reaaaaaally little and I could tell all along, despite him only bringing it up when he was in his late teens.

[Goblin Cat 😸]

As someone who is transgender, I find offense in telling someone this:

I just meant folx should lighten up. You get what you get, so try to enjoy it instead of trying to bring the faults to light!

If it was that easy, I wouldn't be struggling and living the life I am. It is not a choice. I have been psychologically distressed to the point where I have been hospitalized for an attempt on my life because of statements like that when dealing with my identity. I was born the way I am, just as you were born cis. There was no moment when I decided to be trans no more than there was a moment that you decided to be cis. I have just always been this way, like you.

Even if you're not targeting transsexuals in particular, I do think it's not cool to invalidate someone's identity because they do not fit into the binary, like CoriShepard being genderfluid. Their feelings and identity are just as valid and still fall under the trans* identity, even if you don't get it. I think she is right in assuming you don't "get it" because there is no "right way" to be trans. Being trans is a very individualized experience. Everyone is different. Some people don't experience dysphoria. Others are crippled by it. Some people transition. Others don't. Regardless of whether or not they deal with dysphoria, they can still identify as a non binary individual or trans. The difference is that some people require medical treatment, and in that case must be diagnosed with dysphoria (as their identity is not a condition to be treated like a sickness). The only "requirement" to falling under the trans* umbrella is not identifying with the sex you were assigned at birth. That is literally it.

The idea of gender is subjective to anyone you talk to. Sure the binary plays into things in terms of peoples' ideas of masculine or feminine, but the fact of the matter is someone who is trans often deals with gender dysphoria, and that is one of the main factors that seperates them from cis folk. I really don't like the idea that seems to be floating around in this thread that gender and sex are the same. Gender is not about what is between your legs. That is sex. Sex is the biological piece you are referring to. I am a man regardless what my sex is. That is my identity, and it does not amount to my parts. I am not trapped in any body. I am male regardless.

I have been lurking on this thread. I voted, but I didn't want to say anything at first to out myself, but given my fursona is clearly trans, I think it wouldn't be hard to guess that I am as well.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate the idea of being limited to my parts. Gender is more like a spectrum rather than a black and white thing like most people are taught. But, in response to Anoni, there are actually several studies that show that trans peoples' brains are often programmed like the gender they identify as rather than what they were assigned at birth, so it is very much biological.

[saph the sergal]

i DONT care what you identify as i see everyone as equals to myself that we are al people just living life as we see fit is others dont like it well those are the people i tend to ignore and talk to the ones that are positive and dont care what some one identifies as in way of gender so if you want to hate me for saying this fine i dont care but know this I DO NOT JUDGE OTHERS that is all from me

[George]

@Mortimus: I think you're missing the point of what I said. In that wall of text you argued with someone who's against trans-gender stuff n' things, and I'm not. There was no reason to bring up all that, I just said that having some feminine and masculine traits is no reason to freak out. It's normal to break gender stereotypes from time to time. To be honest, I find it abnormal not to!